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[pct-l] Thru-Hikers and cans (was Scary bear story & nothangingfood)


I'd say the parts about hunting bears would teach 'em and that it's the park
service's fault are a little extreme.

>A question for the thru-hikers: Is carrying a can REALLY that serious of a
problem in the areas where they're required? Don't they go into the bounce
boxes when they're not needed?

most thru hikers use micro size packs mike.  Bear cans don't fit.  alot of
folks would have to mail themselves a bigger l/w pack to accomodate the can
for bear alley.

p.s. does anybody have a link to the CURRENT month's PCT-L thread archive ?
I lost mine, and don't think it's on the main page.


----- Original Message -----
From: "dude" <dude@fastmail.ca>
To: <msaenz@mve-architects.com>
Cc: <pct-l@mailman.backcountry.net>
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2004 3:34 PM
Subject: RE: [pct-l] Thru-Hikers and cans (was Scary bear story &

> > I think your perspective is a bit skewed (at least
> > from mine, and I'm a proud card-carrying member of the wacko-RIGHT
> > wing).
> what perspective is this?
> > To change the current policy from
> > co-existence to hunting because a handful of park visitors are
> > inconvenienced is a bit extreme...
> (a) its not just a handful of people who are "inconvenienced".  the
> stats are better these days, but in 1998 there were 1590 bear incidents
> in Yosemite alone that caused $659,000 in damage.
> sources:
> http://www.api4animals.org/1208print.htm
> http://www.theatlantic.com/issues/99aug/9908am.htm
> (b)  I am not suggesting that they just open the park to hunting 24/7
> by anyone who has a gun.  If you read what I wrote, I included the
> word "LIMITED" in there.  It wouldn't take much to re-educate the
> bears.  One week per summer in which a small handful of permits were
> issued for the less populated areas would probably do it.
> Don't get me wrong, I am just as much of a naturalist as anyone, but
> people just can't seem to keep their food away from bears.
> In addition, why don't we FINE THE CRAP out of tourons who feed
> bears???  There are signs, the rangers constantly tell people, and its
> on all the brochures/maps/literature, but PEOPLE STILL FEED THE
> BEARS!!!!  I was in Yosemite two weeks ago and had to tell 3 different
> people to not feed the bears.  There was a ranger right there, and I
> yelled at the tourists feeding bears more than he did. It is true that
> we do invade the bear's home, and guess what... we would not be having
> this discussion if the other tourists that invade the bear's home
> didn't offer the bears candy bars, potato chips, and granola every
> single weekend for decades!  Thru-hikers didn't create this problem,
> the park service and its policies did.  Why should thru-hikers have to
> suffer due to the errors made by the park service.  let them fix their
> own mistakes.  Did you know that the park service used to have a
> garbage dump in Yosemite Valley with bleachers set up around the
> garbage so that tourists could come watch the bears rummage through the
> garbage????  This is 100% true and unembellished, here's a source:
> http://www.yosemite.national-park.com/info.htm
> The park service CREATED the problem, NOT thru-hikers or ultra-lighters.
> I have hiked all through the Sierra several times per year since 1998
> and never used a bear can, and I have never lost my food.  Call me
> lucky, but I have not been avoiding the bears.  I've camped in bear
> alley between tuolumne and yosemite valley and woke up in the middle of
> the night with a bear staring me in the face two feet away.  No bear
> has ever gotten my food.
> Furthermore, I am not entirely sure that the law actually state sthat
> cannisters are required.  the law *used* to say that campers are
> responsible for "proper food storage" and can be fined if bears get
> their food.  Perhaps it has changed and now explicitly states that
> cannisters are required? I don't know.
> I'd even settle for the following comprimise: Require cans and impose a
> $10,000 fine for not carrying one in the backcountry overnight, AND
> impose and *strictly enforce* an equal fine of $10,000 for any tourist
> that allow bears to get their food accidentally, and a $20,000 fine for
> tourists who *voluntarily* feed bears.  I guarantee you, if they
> imposed that kind of policy, you would not need a cannister after
> several years.
> > Do you think the bears will stay away
> > from the scent of food because it'll become scared of people?
> why not?  this has kept bears afraid of people for 1000's of years.
> > A question for the thru-hikers: Is carrying a can REALLY that serious
> > of a problem in the areas where they're required? Don't they go into
> > the bounce boxes when they're not needed?
> Most bounce boxes arent this big.
> > That all said, I'm looking forward to the BV200 passing the test and
> > becoming conditionally approved!
> what's this?
> thanks for the dialogue.
> peace,
> dude
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