[at-l] Keeping it a hiking discussion?

[spiriteagle99 at hotmail.com (Jim and/or Ginny Owen)]

Kelly wrote:
>You know what?  To the thrill of the rest of the people out there who don't
>like me or my posts, congratulations!  You have succeeded in making me feel
>unwelcome enough to unsubscribe from this list for good.  Have a nice day.
>
>GoVols
>PS: those of you who correspond with me off list are still welcome to do 
>so.
>I appreciate the jokes and the things that happen in your everyday life,
>trail related or not.


Kelly -
Yeah - I know you changed your mind - I just finished reading the list and 
caught up on the couple days.   But I wanted you to know that I'll vote for 
you to stay too.

But I also understand Dutch Treat's problem - although he shouldn't have 
singled you out.  What's happened to the list is not really "your" problem - 
or "your" fault.  It's the fault of a lot of those who are old enough to 
know better.  It's one thing to have some "horseplay" on the list - it's a 
lot less acceptable to have "only" horseplay.

And proportionately, there's been damnall little hiking talk lately.  Yeah - 
I know Saunterer hikes - but when was the last time he told anyone here 
about it?  And I don't mean to pick on him - how many others have avoided 
putting trip reports, hiking questions - whatever - on the list?  How many 
trip reports showed up after last weekend - when most of us should have been 
out hiking?

Fact is that if more people put real hiking related stuff - even flames - on 
the list, there'd be a lot less horseplay and Dutch Treat wouldn't be the 
only one who'd be happier.

Hell - when I get a post that says - and I quote -
>Come on guys. No bickering. Let's get back to the important stuff. We still 
>need
>to find a better color for Kelly's counter tops. And I can think of several
>irritating hiking songs that haven't been mentioned.

--- then this list has strayed a long way from where it should be.  And I'm 
not even pickin' on the man who wrote that - I believe it may have been 
written "tongue-in-cheek".  But that's not certain because that kind of 
message carries undertones that make it indeterminate.  As someone once 
taught me - sarcasm on the Internet comes across as anger.

Nor am I saying that your counter top is unimportant - only that it took 
much too much bandwidth - and too much of Ryan's server space.

But somehow when that kind of message is the norm here - and it's been close 
to that lately - then the really important stuff gets lost.  For example - 
how many people on the list know how many people have died on the AT this 
year?  How about on the PCT or CDT?  How did they die? How many know that 
Katahdin was closed for some time?  Or why?

None of those deaths were even mentioned on this list - except for one 
(count'em - ONE) post that Ginny put out.  And that obviously went unread 
because there were no (zero, zed, zilch, nada) comments or questions.  As a 
hiking list - frankly - that sucks.  No wonder she doesn't post here 
anymore.  Think about that - a Triple Crown hiker who rarely posts on at-l 
because what she has to say isn't important enough for anyone to respond to. 
  Really??  Or what about the problems Miss Janet is having right now?  Do 
you know or care what is happening in Erwin?  Or what will happen to the 
hostel in Andover whose owner just passed away?

No, Kelly - it's not your problem.  It's a LIST problem.  And this time, I 
don't have the time or inclination to kick ass and take names - so if the 
LIST doesn't get off their collective tails and fix the problem, then the 
list is gonna become irrelevant.  It may already be so.  Other lists are 
already picking up the slack.

We had some good years back there - we taught a lot of people what they 
needed to know to go out and hike (or thruhike) the AT.  And the "success" 
rate of the group of people we taught was exceeded only by Warren Doyle's 
Appalachian Trail Institute.  (No, Weary - Trailplace never caught up to 
at-l  in that respect)   I've gotta wonder if this group is capable of 
matching or even approaching that performance now - in spite of the recent 
outstanding Trail-related posts  by Datto and Curtis and a few others.   And 
I've gotta wonder how long Ryan will tolerate the misdirection before he 
decides the list isn't worth his time, energy and money.

At this point I'm gonna eat some cold crow - I once berated those who went 
off to the AT2XXX lists.  And I'll apologize to them now.  I've watched too 
many threads, too many newbie questions, too many requests for help or 
information  -- get hijacked or ignored - or just buried under an avalanche 
of unnecessary, superflous and sometimes inane comments.  I still feel as I 
did then, that those lists that are formed from the membership of at-l are a 
betrayal of Ryan and at-l.  But I also know that there's little to hold a 
serious hiker (or thruhiker) on at-l anymore.

Enuff.  Y'all have a good day - and I hope at least a few of you manage to 
actually hike next weekend.  Or maybe do some trailwork.  My thanks to those 
who did so last weekend - and let us know about it.  You give me hope for 
the future of the list.

Hang in there, Kelly -

Walk softly,
Jim

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