[at-l] RE: (OT) The Root of the problem (Tim)

[TRich@FDIC.gov (Rich, Timothy D.)]

Good Morning,
 
Still off-topic, and I apologize to the list.  However, since RnR opted to
resurrect an 18 day old post and respond to the list, I'll reiterate.  To
answer RnR's allegation that I've misquoted him, I've pasted his original
post at the very bottom.
 
First - RnR, I've not misquoted you.  I stand by my conclusion that you go
off half-cocked with off-thread responses.  I believe some of these wayward
posts are the result of faulty comprehension, but I also believe many are
foisted upon the list to forward your personal agenda.  Second - I give no
credence to any argument that is based upon the actions of the United
Nations.  It is a morally bankrupt organization controlled by countries with
abhorrent human rights practices.  
 
Third, if you think Congress is acutely interested in your so-called
"widening gap between the rich and poor", you're right, but for the wrong
reason.  Many are absolutely counting on it - not the income gap, but the
tax gap.  We are nearing a point where the majority of voters do not pay any
income tax.  None.  When that actually happens, turn out the lights.  The
portion that high achievers pay relative to what they earn continues to
increase, and the portion of those tax filers who pay no income tax is
sitting around 46 percent.  That's straight from the records of the Infernal
Revenue Service.
 
Finally, I specifically referred you to Thomas Sowell's 1/14 article because
I thought of you when I read this portion:
"Why then is it so surprising that the most productive country in the world
is so hated among those who lag far behind? Whatever the shortcomings of
Americans -- real and imagined -- shortcomings are common to all peoples.
That can hardly be the basis for singling out Americans as objects of a
special wrath and venom. 


What is new in history is the internal hostility to American society by some
of its own citizens who have benefited from its productivity and its
generosity. No one has been more favored and indulged than those in academia
and the media -- and no one has acted more like spoiled brats. 



Their ego problem is quite different. These are people convinced of their
own superior wisdom and virtue, who are constantly trying to impose that
wisdom and virtue on others, whether by media spin, government regulation,
classroom propaganda, or moral intimidation. 



Their exalted vision of themselves is frustrated by the fact that the vast
majority of other Americans reject -- or, worse yet, ignore -- their
presumptions of moral leadership. To some of us, that is called freedom.
But, to the self-anointed, it is enough to produce hostility to the values
and traditions of American society."

I'll give Dr. Sowell the last word.
 
Take Care,
 
Tim

-----Original Message-----
From: RoksnRoots@aol.com [mailto:RoksnRoots@aol.com]
Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 12:48 AM
To: Rich, Timothy D.
Cc: AT-L@backcountry.net
Subject: (OT) The Root of the problem (Tim)


In a message dated 1/18/02 8:15:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, TRich@FDIC.gov
writes: 




 For your reading pleasure, I recommend 
www.worldnetdaily.com and www.newsmax.com as well as the columnists of the 
Jewish World Review, including the brilliant Thomas Sowell 
http://www.jewishworldreview.com/cols/sowell1.asp
<http://www.jewishworldreview.com/cols/sowell1.asp>   

    ***  I said "rumors". Which always worries me when the media has dropped
its concern over reporting factual information no matter how much it hurts.
I thought that was the reason for its being? 
     I would also recommend the 'Middle Eastern Report' based in Washington.
It provides more complete information than the one-sided media. Recently,
some Israeli troops have refused to commit UN violating acts against
innocent civilians in the territories. Yes, suicide bombing should never
happen either... 

Our bombing is not and has not been haphazard.  Please see 
http://stingray.tamu.edu/downloads/taliban_attack.ppt for further, albeit 
graphic, information of what forward air controllers (special forces) are 
doing.  You allege the U.S. seeks illegitimate (I guess you mean civilian) 
targets.

   *** If you could reread my report I said nothing similar to that. You
should refrain from misquoting me for whatever purpose. If you were accurate
you would know that a convoy of allies was bombed killing 60 friendlies
going to a meeting on cooperating with the new government. First they said
it was a legitimate target, then they said they were given bad info. I would
think the top pros you are referring to would at least check to see if they
were or not before killing them. My guess is Osama fever myself. In any
case, the dead friendlies going to help the US would be glad you were so
confident and comfortable in your version. (PS: We've accidentally killed
more civilians since your denial) 
    Tim, have you ever heard of misinformation or spin control? I hate to
break it to your virgin ears, but governments have been known to not tell
the entire truth before. My point was that there was no way of knowing if
the media isn't living up to its duty. Just taking the government's word is
kind of un-American -isn't it???   



You then toss the Israelis into your diatribe, essentially stating 
that their actions, unlike the suicide bombers, are the very definition of 
state sponsored terrorism.

   ***  The United Nations council said the same thing when they condemned
them. With a US veto, they've ignored that consistently. Once again you jump
to having me saying I back the suicide bombers. Why do you do that? Would
the truth be the only other option? 

 You also include an erroneous Ashcroft 


allegation. 




   *** From what I've read he has blocked access to the Freedom of
Information Act for the "War On Terrorism"... 

 Toss in your misguided free speech posts, and you're just 


'ridgetop condo development'
    ***  Are you somehow suggesting the pure free-blooded practice of
mountain top development near the AT is legitimized by political
affiliation? Please answer me how this could be good for the Trail? 

, 'get rich off the backs of the poor' 

    ***   Please, even Congress recognizes the widening gap in this country
and how it can't be good for the system we've always expected (the same one
you defend here, if you care to realize). Your response sounds like weak
baiting... 



and 'real trail advocacy issues are attacked on this list' phrases away from

having your complete manifesto within a single digest. 

Congratulations are in order. 

Tim 




       ***   I would hope people delve deeper than this into important
matters. This answer has all the right reasons for not looking deeper
without really saying anything...  
 

 RnR stated: "One thing that bugs me is the rumor that 5000 innocent
civilians were killed by
haphazard bombing targeting and no mention of this has come through on our
free media. I guess we
have a free media until the government orders otherwise. The targets were
always "legitimate
targets" even though they were either caravans of allies, or civilian
houses. The attention span of
the American public has not called for the truth just yet. Also, did you
know that the Freedom of
Information Act was recently overridden by Ashcroft for the War on
Terrorism? Elsewhere, though they
are facing a similar opponent, the Israelis are currently bulldozing down
innocent civilian housing
in order to secure their state. I can't remember ever hearing of any
convention allowing direct
retaliation against innocent civilians for purposes of putting pressure on
the enemy. Yes, the
suicide bombers do the same thing -but not with the backing, propaganda, and
blessing of our
powerful government. That seems slightly hypocritical to me. In fact, I
think the mike is turned off
on that too and the topic is not permitted in mainstream media."