[at-l] (WF - delete alert) "AT-List mostly doesn't talk about...

[RoksnRoots@aol.com (RoksnRoots@aol.com)]

In a message dated 10/9/01 6:03:47 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
OIdMaster@aol.com writes:


> ~WingFraud only wanted the credit for "Saving Saddleback."

      *** I believe Wingfoot possesses a genuine interest in Trail 
conservation. But even if he did do it totally for egotistical purposes, I 
would have to go along with it because he is the only one I know who at least 
attempted the intended result via a public access forum. I would be glad to 
hear of others. 


> that the way to sway local officials was to engage 
> local voters, and not to 
> Spam their emailboxes with form emails from people from one website.

     *** WF lives in North Carolina. This burden of having to access locally 
appears, to me, to be a predesigned tactic to avoid greater involvement. The 
Trail is, after all, a national level entity, it should be accessible on a 
federal level when such problems arise. "Spamming mailboxes" is derogatory 
and disrespectfully inappropriate for a person attempting to save Saddleback. 
As I said before, the general result of this is to paint AT advocacy in a 
negative light to the Trail interested. 

> kicked people off Trailplace for saying he should support or organize 
> local 
> 'real' letter campaigns, organize phonecall campaigns, and organize locals 
> to 
> go to local meetings.

    *** Maybe he couldn't handle all that alone. He had a single objective 
and cut anybody who didn't go along (hrrmm, hrrmm AT-L). I won't comment 
other than it is your decision as to how you judge the ejections.

> care about an email 
> flood from out-of-state more than letters from actual 
> voters.

     *** As does the ATC's Startzell (sp?) who commented that insiders knew 
the real affect his campaign had on the involved politicians. After I posted 
that in refute of previous posts discrediting WF's effectiveness I was 
suddenly not answered on AT-L. WF's e-mail campaign returned a hard copy 
letter which most forwarded on. Those only concerned with WF discrediting 
know that yet prefer to keep on referring to futile e-mail "spamming". They 
are not credible references on his campaigns because they have distanced 
themselves so far as to not be informed. They prefer the type of offhanded 
slanders above in lieu of accuracy.
 
~Weary and Trailplace's Rock&Root continue to post untruths here 
> hoping to sway the opinions of the under-informed. WingFraud's email Spam 
> campaign failed because Collins, Snowe and others didn't care how many form 
> letters they got from his website during his ego trip. The 'other side' won 
> because they organized local voters and swayed local opinion. That's the 
> truth of the matter.

*** There is enough information on the town mob type campaign with 
'predisposed' politicians gathered, that to refer to that as effective 
organization strains belief and taints the commentary. (especially after the 
developer has already cashed in and quit those supporters) Quick postcards 
garnered by reactionary rights fronts in a mailsack is Old Masters suggestion 
as legitimate local input WF failed to match.
   I find it interesting that I am called "Trailplace's RnR". If I referred 
to Old Master as "Anti-Trailplace Old Master" I'm sure I would be breaking an 
oath or such -or perhaps disrupting camaraderie. As I said, the untruths are 
not from this side. If you were more in touch with TP you would see that. I 
don't see how people who loathe TP and don't attend it can wage an accusation 
of being "under-informed" on Trailplace matters when they don't even use the 
site. Seems instantly apparent to me. 
     I like reading the trail accounts on AT-L. I just think it needn't be so 
restrictive about content or overemphasize conduct to such an extreme.



> WingFraud's For Profit Trailplace and the one-man-sham "Center for AT 
> Studies" are up and running again. (He takes Visa for online donations now) 
> His email list is back, too.  Perhaps you two should stop wasting your time 
> here and go home.
> Old 
> oidmaster@aol.com


    *** Did it ever occur to you the Center needs to be institutionalized as 
such for tax purposes? That is simple. To harp on it or assign ignoble 
purposes is uncalled for in my opinion. I for one, as well as some others, 
would tell you they learned a lot from CATS and appreciated being able to 
participate in Trail conservation campaigns via his site that they might not 
have otherwise. That is hardly something to condemn. 
    Really, some of the worst violations and offenses against the "pledge" 
have come from the side purporting to uphold it in the name of supporting a 
sense of community. Should an AT member ever have to be worried because he 
spoke his mind about what he felt to be important to the Trail amongst the 
Trail community? I have never seen either Weary nor my 'Trailplace' self 
speak in such a way to another campfire member as you have in your last line. 
When I see such it makes me think an uncomfortable truth was reached. If 
these things are important and contemporary to the Trail we should be able to 
speak about them without fearing any member imposed conformity or exile.

    Respectfully,
  
      R 'n R






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